hanashimasu vs hanasemasu (2025)

Hi there,

I'm working through Pimsleur's Japanese vol.1 and it teaches you how to say "I speak Japanese" as "nihongo ga hanashimasu" and "I can/am able to speak Japanese" as "nihongo ga hanasemasu".

This is confusing me. I thought that to show potential (i.e. that you can do something) you use the ~koto ga dekiru form. So what is hanasemasu? If it comes from the verb "hanaseru", is this a verb in itself just like all other verbs or is it a combination of "hanasu" and "suru"? If the latter, then can you show potential using other verbs, like "nomimasu" vs "nomemasu" (I drink vs I can drink)?

Cheers

Just another form that's all. There was a discussion re. this recently in another thread somewhere.

hanaseru basically means hanasu koto ga dekiru. It's a conjugation of hanasu. In the case of nomu (nomimasu), it's nomeru (nomemasu). Taberu-->taberareru, suru-->dekiru, kuru-->koreru, yaru-->yareru, iku-->ikeru, korosu-->koroseru lol. Keep in mind the type of verb you are conjugating.

Often Japanese say tabereru instead of taberareru, probabaly because in terms of conjugation, taberareru can also mean 'to be eaten'; therefore the distinction for sake of clarity. Might just be bad grammar in some cases too.

You can show potential both ways. With -u verbs, you drop the -u and add -eru to make them reflect the potential. For example iku becomes ikeru and hanasu becomes hanaseru. For -ru verbs, basically lop off the -ru and add -rareru. Both these forms conjugate like regular -ru verbs.

I think this is the more common form of potential that is used as I never hear -koto ga dekiru used much in either my books or any Japanese thing I watch, but I'm sure someone here may know that.

Index said:

Just another form that's all. There was a discussion re. this recently in another thread somewhere.

hanaseru basically means hanasu koto ga dekiru. It's a conjugation of hanasu. In the case of nomu (nomimasu), it's nomeru (nomemasu). Taberu-->taberareru, suru-->dekiru, kuru-->koreru, yaru-->yareru, iku-->ikeru, korosu-->koroseru lol. Keep in mind the type of verb you are conjugating.

Often Japanese say tabereru instead of taberareru, probabaly because in terms of conjugation, taberareru can also mean 'to be eaten'; therefore the distinction for sake of clarity. Might just be bad grammar in some cases too.

Click to expand...

I hear the words tabereru quite often too. However I can't quite understand its contextual usage. I keep on wondering why they dont use taberareru. I think the same way as INDEX. Hopefully someone from this forum can pinpoint the reasons behind the usage of these two forms.

I was told the difference is hanshimasu is standard positive form where hanasemasu is saying "having the chance to speak"

Nihon ni eigo wo hanasemasendeshita - I didn't have a chance to speak english in Japan. (Implying you would have if you were able to)

Nihon ni eigo wo hanashimasendeshita - I didn't speak english in Japan.
(You were not going to speak english even if you were able to)

Kirisame said:

I hear the words tabereru quite often too. However I can't quite understand its contextual usage. I keep on wondering why they dont use taberareru. I think the same way as INDEX. Hopefully someone from this forum can pinpoint the reasons behind the usage of these two forms.

Click to expand...

I'm not familiar with the exact reason, but it's analogous with the させられた form becoming せられた . The "ra" couldn't be pulled in this case or it would be opposite in meaning. In the case of "erareru" and "ereru" probably not because it was confused with the passive tense, though, since it has only happened fairly recently. :?

「ら」を抜いた言い方は、最近はみんなが使うので批判する人は専門家くらいでしょう。

I look at it as being similar to ellision in English. It simplifies the pronunciation while leaving the meaning still perfectly clear.

A common one I hear in my work is "dereru" in place of "derareru".

"Taberareru" and "tabereru" are essentially the same--a typical example of ら抜き言葉（らぬきことば）.

As Elizabeth says, most Japanese speak without the "ra" in this verb conjugation--even people in my generation (postwar baby boomers). You can use it talking and writing to your friends and acquaintances. However, it is still a no-no in formal writing. It will also impress older people you are able to speak with the "ra" included. So, I recommend being "bicultural" (young & old Japanese language-capable).
Note: Professional writers and speakers (such as TV announcers and narrators) are still thrashed when they inadvertently skip the "ra."

Thanks epigene for the clarification. Now I know how the cultural usage of
ら抜き言葉（らぬきことば） is like.

Ok, here's what I found from my japanese textbook.

Long form（－られる) Short form (-れる）
見る 見られる 見れる
着る 着られる 着れる

Additional reference examples for everyone.

Thanks for clearing it up for me everyone.

Cheers!